INTERVIEW WITH HAROLD CHERN
This interview for the Columbus Jewish Historical Society is being recorded on March 17, 2007 for the Columbus Jewish Historical Society's Oral History Project and for inclusion in the archives collection of Congregation Beth Tikvah. The interview is being recorded at First Community Church Health Care Center, Upper Arlington, Ohio. Our names are Rhoda Gelles and Rose Luttinger and we are interviewing Harold Chern.
Rhoda Gelles
What is your full name?
How far back do you want to go? Harold Leonard Chern.
Do you have a Jewish name?
Chaim. Go ahead, I will answer what I can, go ahead.
Do you know who you were named for?
I was named for a grandfather whom I never met. He died before I ever met him.
Whose father was he, your mothers or your fathers?
On my mother's side.
Do you know what your mother's full name was, her maiden name?
Rebecca
Do you know her maiden name?
The name that her family was known by here was Jamison, but that was after a bunch of them said we'll all switch that way. I don't have one with me, but there was a picture of her own with her family that was taken after she came over here. She was just two years old.
Where did she come from?
They came from some town in Russia, It was someplace called "NoviKraka ?." What the actual spelling is I don't know. Nobody knows what it really was. The name of Jamison is supposed to have been sprung from "czymushin ?". That goes way back, about 100 years.
What year did she come here?
It was somewhere around 1890 I guess.
Where was your father born?
Russia.
In the same town as your mother?
I have no idea. They never knew each other over there. They didn't meet until some place here. I'm not sure exactly where. Who knows whether the Chern comes from
Chernoble, where they had the accident or Chernoblesky which is a name he had when he came over here. That was the first name they had, Chernoble.
Where did your family live when you were growing up?
Well, a great deal of the time, it was important, when I was advancing in years. I was born in Philadelphia, lived there for six years. Then I lived in Atlantic City for my grade school and high school. That was in Atlantic City, New Jersey.
How did your parents earn their living?
Anyway he could. He started out, his family didn't have anything left when they got over here and he did some work to help the family when he was 11 years old, overnight.
They did that in those days, like Charlie Chaplin, but not as well.
Do you have any brothers or sisters?
My sister passed away about a year ago, my younger sister, about 8 years younger.
What was her name?
The name we knew her by was Elaine. I think originally the name was Esther Zelda.
Where did she live?
She lived with us in Atlantic City until she got married. Then she and her husband lived in a suburb of Washington D.C.
You graduated from High School?
Oh yes, I finished 4 years of college.
Where did you go to college?
I went to Ursinus. It's an eastern school. I don't know if you're familiar with it.
No, where is it located?
Collegeville, Pennsylvania. Not state college, that is different. State College is in another town altogether. State College is in about the middle of the state and
Collegeville, PA . was about 60 miles west of Philadelphia. I got there, I had a basketball scholarship.
Did you play basketball in High School? Oh yes, of course. So that's why you are so interested in hearing the basketball game today. Oh no, I just like basketball.
I like football. I didn't play football.
Were you ever in the military?
Yes, I was a pilot of a B24 Bomber in 1944. I saw 35 combat missions. I was the first pilot.
Can you tell us any other memories of serving in that war?
Well, that was a whole other story because back in those days it was the beginning of the draft and you went in with the idea that you would be in for a year. It was during
Roosevelt's time. As it turned out we were given a number, we went back home, they called our number, or we could get started ahead of time. I volunteered to start my year ahead of time because I knew that Helen was going to finish college. She met me in the same school where I went. Then came Pearl Harbor and that was the end of that dream.
Did you spend any time in Europe?
Yes, I flew out of Italy. It's pretty hard to bomb Europe from the United States. I was assigned to a B24 after finishing my training. There were a lot of boys and young men in the same position, never had a foot in an airplane before. We went through flight training, 3 schools. Then I got my wings and my commission and went for bomber training in California. When I finished the training, I was assigned to a combat group and I was given a crew and a B24 which was a liberator. I flew it from California east to southern Florida. When I went from southern Florida, in various jumps, we went to South America, went to Foraleza, in Brazil. Then we went across the ocean to Dakar, in Africa. From Dakar, we went up to Italy and that's where we were based for most of our combat missions. We had special risks, different assignments. In addition to flying combat missions, we were in an unusual position because right after there was a southern invasion of France. Nobody ever knows about that. All they know is the big invasion. There was a southern invasion of France and we went from there, for a short period of time we acted as a group for ferrying ammunition, bombs and other stuff, from Italy to France. It's a whole story within itself. I don't want to put people to sleep.
Did you have any contact with any of the concentration camps at the end of the war?
No, because by that time, I came back to the United States in December, 1944. I finished my combat missions.
Rose Luttinger
What did you major in when you were in college?
Business Administration.
What did you do after you came back from the war?
After I came back from the war I became involved in the steel industry, heavy duty weighing equipment. I acted as a salesman and I was a branch manager. I was a partial owner of a very unsuccessful business.
You met Helen in college?
I was a sophomore. As I said, I went there on a basketball scholarship. Her home was in a suburb of Reading, Pennsylvania. She lived in Mount Penn and she came there as a freshman the following year after I came there as a freshman.
When did you get married?
We were married in April, 1942, not too long after Pearl Harbor.
How old were you when you got married?
I was 25 and Helen was 22. Everybody said it wouldn't last 2 years. And you fooled them.
Why and when did you move to Columbus?
It was after I got in the scale business and there was a dealer who sold and installed scales in Columbus. He was a customer of mine at first and then he asked me to come into partnership with him.
Where did you live before you were here?
Before we were here, I came back from the service and got out in June, 1945. Actually I would have been out earlier because they had a point system and fellows like myself, a lot of us got out earlier. But anyway, that's when I got out. It was just serendipity really.
Why did you choose the area that you chose to move into in Columbus?
You mean in Upper Arlington? Yes. We knew some people here and they thought it was a good place for our children to go to school. As it turned out, It was not only good for our children but it was good for our grandchildren because all of them went to Upper Arlington High School.
We know you joined Beth Tikvah. How did you happen to come to Beth Tikvah?
Well, I was part of coming to Beth Tikvah, as far as that goes. The 2 guys who were responsible for setting up Beth Tikvah at first were, I can't remember their names.
You probably have them listed somewhere. (Richard) Goldgraben? Yes Goldgraben was another one. Dave Brilliant? No, he was after. Dave Brilliant became the first
President of the new Beth Tikvah after the 2 originators, just a short time after, objected to the fact that we became reformed. We were a very small group. We were trying to decide because when we went to the East side of Columbus for help, everybody on the East side said we don't need anymore Jewish congregations. We have enough. I took a hand in that, I must say, because I objected to them telling us what we should or shouldn't do. So then we formed a congregation and after we formed the congregation we took a vote and decided that we were going to go reformed.
Can you tell us a little bit about the early history of Beth Tikvah?
Yes, after the 2 guys who helped start it went away. One was Richard Goldgraben and I can't remember the other one. Yes, it's not an unusual name either. I should be able to remember it. Anyway, we started up and we had an election of our own.
I think we had maybe 15 families who were members at that time. We elected officers and Dave Brilliant was the first President. The second President, who followed him, was Vice President at that time, was Dave Guttman. I was the third President. Dave Brilliant and Dave Guttman passed on so I am the oldest President because of the fact the other two died.
Rhoda
You were president from 1964-1965?
I'll take your word for it because I don't remember it. If it says it, I believe it. I have no reason to question it because I was the third one.
Why don't you say into the microphone the years that you were President ?
The years that I was president, you're going to have to tell me. 1964-1965, 1964-1965. That really doesn't come up as it was because after I got out you got Morris Ojalvo. He really didn't want to become President He was too busy so then I volunteered to act as President for that Summer after we elected him President. I was just temporary President during that one particular Summer ,1964.
Where was Beth Tikvah located then?
Beth Tikvah started out, it could be anywhere. At first we were using somebody else's facility, then we rented a place of our own. It was a house at the corner of East North Broadway and High Street. It was home for a couple years and then we ended up buying a building.
Was that the one on Indianola?
Yes, that was later, on Indianola.
Who was the Rabbi at that time, do you remember?
Who was the Rabbi? I should know him well too. Bennett Hermann? Yes, Bennett Hermann. At first he was a student at Hebrew Union in Cincinnati and then we put our necks out and decided to hire him as a full-time Rabbi. That was it. He became the Rabbi at that point.
Did your kids go to Sunday School at Beth Tikvah?
When it started out, Helen ran it.
Did they have the Hebrew School then too?
We had somebody, again I think it was Bennett Hermann, who came up once or twice a month and got them started.
II think his wife was the Hebrew teacher too, wasn't she?
She was involved in some manner. Exactly what I don't recall because I don't remember exactly when Manny and Rose (Luttinger) came into the picture. Manny could tell you better than anybody. We are going to interview Manny too.
I know that Helen was active in the synagogue too. She was very active.
What kinds of things did she do?
The reason she became active was because they had a Sisterhood. That was the time when I was President. They wanted her to act as the President for the Sisterhood. On first request I told her to forget about it because of the religion difference, but then they went on to disband the Sisterhood altogether. She and somebody else, I don't remember who now, came to me and said look this is what we are faced with. I said if it was a question of wiping out the Sisterhood, forget it, just go ahead and you can act as President during that time.
Did Helen convert to Judaism?
Never, I didn't ask her and she didn't volunteer. But she was very active all the time.
Who was a Rabbi on the East Side? Folkman? Rabbi Folkman once told her she was more Jewish than some of the Jewish women we have here. I'm sure that's true.
Can you remember anything else you'd like to tell us, any interesting or amusing stories about Beth Tikvah in those days?
One story I can remember was when we bought this building and we had it and we decided the High Holidays were coming up and we wanted to redecorate somewhat.
We decided we wanted to repaint it on the inside and that's when I first got to know Manny (Luttinger). He showed up with a paint brush in hand ready to go to work.
At that time Manny wasn't sure what his feeling was toward Judaism at that point or how deeply he wanted to become involved. Anyway, he and I talked it over and he became a member. He not only became a member but he became a very, very strong member and that solidified his feeling about Judaism.
You moved away from Columbus several years ago after your children were grown up.
It was quite a while afterwards, yes. This again could be hazy and I don't want to be taken literally. I wanted to go back East where our families were and that's why we actually moved back East. My family lived in Atlantic City and Helen's family lived in Reading and we wound up in New England. We spent about 4 years in West Hartford, Ct.
Where are your grown children settled now?
Gail is in Columbus. She is a very prominent attorney with a big company, and has been for some time. What is her married name? Ford. Mike, our older son, our first born, is in Reno, Nevada. He's in the computer industry. Gail was next and Gail went to OSU and studied, I can't think of the exact term of it, when you work for other people, she was in Social Work. After she got into social work she had some kind of an assist from the university because of her efforts. She got something like a scholarship in social work. After she got into social work, she felt she wanted to provide more for her children and Gail went on then to advanced social work. She and her husband, Len Ford, talked it over and Gail said that she was going to go to night school to study to be an attorney. They talked it over and they decided that one way or another he and she would pick up the loose corners and she went to night school. She became a member of Law General. She did very well at Law School and as an attorney. She became the most prominent or second most prominent attorney.
I remember your daughter, Joanne. What is she doing now?
Joanne lives in Indiana. I used to write letters to her all the time, I don't write much any more. She went to work helping out in a coffee shop and eventually bought the coffee shop. She owns the coffee shop. What about Barry? Barry, in some ways he probably had more talent than some of the others. Barry wanted to be a musician and an artist. He followed that as well as he could. He continues doing those things.
Rose
What were your children's experiences at Beth Tikvah?
It just became a part of everyday life. It just came along because I was active and Helen was active, they became more or less active.
Rhoda
When did you move back to Columbus, how many years ago did you move back?
I think it was 1958. This is when I became associated with the School Board. In Upper Arlington? No, Beth Tikvah School Board.
You moved away and you moved to Hartford and you came back fairly recently, did you?
That becomes hazier because of the fact that moving East was just to be with our family and then I became involved in the scale business with this dealer and became a part of his business.
You came back to Upper Arlington a few years ago to be close to your daughter and son-in-law and grandchildren?
Oh no, they came along later after we moved back. I think it was in 1958 but don't hold me to that. We bought this house on Wellesley Drive and as a result of that we wound up right near the High School. Again it was a serendipity thing. It wasn't that we did that because of wisdom. The next thing you know, all of our kids were going to school within shouting distance, very close, right around the corner practically. We were very lucky we had our kids go to the High School and our grandchildren.
We really appreciate your taking the time to talk to us.
It isn't so much taking the time or anything. This past month or so took a lot out of me.
On top of that Helen became demented. At first she was very active with the Sisterhood. When we moved where we moved in Upper Arlington, we didn't know it was going to be a lifetime thing. I was so used to moving because of the Service and things like that. We just went from pillar to post.
I think we are finished now. On behalf of the Columbus Jewish Historical Society and Congregation Beth Tikvah we want to thank you for contributing to the oral history project and to the Beth Tikvah's Archives Project.
Well I wish I could have done a better job.
Oh you did a wonderful job and thank you so much.
It's nice of you to say that.
